Hi Kanadian,
Do you mind if I ask where you got the following information?
“Did you know that according to the Thai government Philippinos should be paid not less then 30 000 Thai Baht a month, Anglo Saxons or as Thai’s call us farang, should be paid 60000 a month, Europeans is around 25000 per month.“
Forgive me, but aren’t Europeans also Anglo Saxons, or am I missing something?
“Kick the schools where they hurt, in the pocket! And if foreigners who have fake degrees don’t comply, have the ASSOCIATION law write a letter to the Dean of the school, with a cc to the Ministry of Immigration, Ministry of Labour ETC..“
Certainly isn’t anybody going to be calling you a pansy when it comes to ideas for action!
“I tried this idea a few years ago. However none of the boys wanted to help out. I know it’s overdue!“
Can’t imagine you were “Mr. Popular” at that time. Umm…I wonder why people were so reluctant to start policing their peers?! Anyone got any ideas?
Tom
I think that’s an excellent idea. Start an organization for foreign teachers. Did you know that according to the Thai government Philippinos should be paid not less then 30 000 Thai Baht a month, Anglo Saxons or as Thai’s call us farang, should be paid 60000 a month, Europeans is around 25000 per month. Kick the schools where they hurt, in the pocket ! And if foreigners who have fake degrees don’t comply, have the ASSOCIATION law write a letter to the Dean of the school, with a cc to the Ministry of Immigration, Ministry of Labour ETC.. I tried this idea a few years ago. However none of the boys wanted to help out. I know it’s overdue !
Hi Berne,
“The native English speaker concept is the biggest con after Hitlers superman…“
I think you mean Nietzsche’s “Superman” (Ubermensch) which Hitler adopted for his fanatical plans.
“...if citizens of former English colonies like US, Canada, Australia, Ireland and South Africa are called NES’s, then other commonwealth country citizens should also be categorized the same as the language was brought to them by the English colonizer…“
Were you actually trying to be serious when you wrote this, or were you on the falling down water? Yes, you were talking about former commonwealth countries but, by the same definition, if I teach a Japanese man English, he must be classed as a native speaker? Because the language was brought to him in Osaka by a native speaker? Or a french housewife? Living in Calais? Or how about a Nepalese yak herder?
I once had an argument with an editor of the Bangkok Post who tried to convince me that I should be calling Nigerians, Jamaicans, and Sri Lankans native speakers. I wasn’t buying it then, and I’m not buying it now.
Completely agree with the following:
“I personally feel many of the administrators don’t even know the real academic meaning of the concept but just write it in their ads for students and prospective employees to sound intellectual… thus presenting pseudo teachers by highlighting their nationality instead of qualification.“
I think we should make clear that people don’t set out to discriminate - it just happens when a policy is not properly understood; it is more often than not an effect rather than a cause, so in that sense is not a personal choice that someone deliberately chooses to follow. But yes, I do agree that the bottom line is profits and all other considerations take a back seat.
“Discrimination is a personal choice of every institute as they have to pursue their enterprise and profits but at the expense of their clients learning which seems to be the best business all over is debatable.“
Again I agree here:
“Remember today edutainment is more in demand not traditional education thus schools and traditional centers of learning are getting carried away by this trend. And for edutainment the academic qualifications can be wavered as the color scheme of the photographs and the fun is what really seem to matter.“
This is known as the “sanook factor” in Thailand and is indispensable.
We also see this not only in education, but also in journalism where news has become a commodity to be bought and sold like oil, gas, diamonds and gold. People want their news to be gift wrapped, and presented in bite-sized chunks for easier digestion and, above all, to remove the possibility that they might have to actually think about what’s going on around them! They have become numbed by an endless bombardment of rolling news and having it presented to them in easy A + B = C format, is the preferred choice for many.
“For government schools where the responsibility of the institute is to ensure that their students learn as much as they need to for social empowerment unlike private and international schools where their clients can afford coming back for more..“
If you say so, but this is debatable.
Agree with the following up to a point:
“In simple terms it is the best way for the social elite and rulers of a society to keep their subjects or citizens under their purview weak in this international business language by allowing schools and educational institutes to employ folk who are not qualified by academic pursuit but by nationality.“
But the problem arises when Thailand lags behind as a knowledge economy and doesn’t have enough skilled people to keep the country competitive in the world’s marketplaces. Exports drop and ultimately it is the clever “amata” wise ones who suffer as they are the ones who most reap the benefits of this unfair system.
“It may sound like a conspiracy but the truth is if everyone learns this language who is gonna be left behind to do all the menial jobs and low paying jobs.“
Agreed, which is why there is a 100,000 shortfall of teachers in Thailand.If the powers-that-be were really serious about improving the standards, they’d have already fixed this problem.
You may have a point here:
“My observation of academic institutes in developed countries and developing ones the scheme for teaching this important language is kind of opposite. The developed countries have high standards for employing teachers while in developing countries (using ajarn.com as an example) you can see how institutes pursue employing folk based on a bias which has been successful in proving the possible conspiracy to be true.“
I am technically (in academic terms) supposed to be a Native English speaker as it is a language I’ve spoken and studied ever since I was a child but wont qualify as my nationality is not from the commonwealth or these so called native English speaking countries.“
So, where are you from?
“Most of my teachers and classmates rarely spoke English outside the classroom. This debate will go on with no real conclusion as the folk who use the phrase don’t even read such blogs….“
Again, you may be right but this is a reason to not talk about it with a view to changing it, right?
Thanks for your post.
Tom
Hi Jack,
“I’m American, Caucasian, and understand the resentment from especially Phillipinos, yet I don’t pay your salary, its not MY fault, and the answer certainly couldn’t be that I’m going to work for less.“
Nobody’s saying it is Jack?! And nobody would expect you to!
“You have to demand the same salary, as a group. Get together and unionize if necessary. You are participating in the discrimination by accepting it.“
Slightly myopic viewpoint Jack. As soon as they got together to complain, they would be out the door faster than a Hawaiian pizza delivery from Pizza Hut on a Friday night!
You may be in a position to do that because the laws of supply and demand favour you, with your white skin and American accent, but the same is not true for Filipinos or other minorities.
If you have any other suggestion slightly more constructive and/or realistic, please add them.
Thanks for your post though.
Tom
Hi Tom
As it pertains to aren’t Europeans Anglo Saxon – well we both know that answer. I was just repeating what the Thai government said. Please don’t shoot the messenger. My intent to form a union was based on a simple idea of honest day’s pay for an honest day’s work. After all sticks and stones … right ?
I’m sure you know the expression. If you actually looked at the source of revenue Thai schools make, it will shock you ! Tom did you know the under the current Thai Ministry of Labour Act, schools are required to give severance pay? This part comes under section 118 ss I, ii and ii . Did you know the employer thus including Thai schools MUST GIVE 30 days notice if the contact will not be renewed ? Did you also know the if the employer does not comply with this section of the act, they must pay the foreign teacher one month’s salary in lieu of notice. But, the facts are the facts. Thai schools don’t give a bean, and the Ministry of Labour won’t enforce the regulations.
By Kanadian, on the beach on 2010-06-06